SBCC Vaquero Voices

Episode 49 - Jordan Killebrew

Episode Summary

Hong and Akil welcome Jordan Killebrew to the show! Jordan is SBCC's new Executive Director of Public Affairs and Communications, and stops by to outline his plans for the office and position, his path to SBCC, and his love for soul food and Kathy Najimy. Along the way, the trio also discuss some of the best Chinese food in Santa Barbara, pomegranate season, and being patient with ourselves in navigating the world at large.

Episode Notes

Mentioned in this episode:

SBCC Office of Communications - https://www.sbcc.edu/officeofcommunications/

Jessica Fletcher - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jessica_Fletcher

OOC Staff - https://www.sbcc.edu/officeofcommunications/staff.php

My SBCC - https://www.sbcc.edu/mysbcc/

Adventism - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adventism

UCSB Resident Assistants - https://www.housing.ucsb.edu/current-residents/become-a-resident-assistant/overview

Isla VIsta Love and Remembrance Garden - http://www.ivparks.org/memorialgarden/lrg.html

Santa Barbara Foundation - https://sbfoundation.org/

Cheez-It Mac and Cheese - https://www.foodnetwork.com/recipes/three-cheese-mac-with-cheez-itreg-herb-crumb-crust-recipe-3383242

Cheesecake - https://cooking.nytimes.com/recipes/1019037-classic-cheesecake

Pomegranate - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pomegranate

Fesenjoon - https://cooking.nytimes.com/recipes/1020224-khoresh-e-fesenjoon-persian-chicken-stew-with-pomegranate-and-walnuts

Meet Up Restaurant - https://www.meetuprestaurant.com/

Sichuan Peppercorn - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sichuan_pepper

Scavengers Reign - https://www.max.com/shows/scavengers-reign/50c8ce6d-088c-42d9-9147-d1b19b1289d4

Scavengers (Original short that led to Scavengers Reign) - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1TRzemJbUsw

N95 by Kendrick Lamar (contains lyric Jordan mentioned) - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zI383uEwA6Q

Black Cake by Charmaine WIlkerson - https://charmspen.com/black-cake/

SOS by SZA - https://www.szasos.com/

Praise A Lord Who Chews But Which Does Not Consume; (Or Simply, Hot Between Worlds) by Yves Tumor - https://yves-tumor.bandcamp.com/album/praise-a-lord-who-chews-but-which-does-not-consume-or-simply-hot-between-worlds

My Soft Machine by Arlo Parks - https://arloparks.bandcamp.com/album/my-soft-machine

Collapsed in Sunbeams by Arlo Parks - https://arloparks.bandcamp.com/album/collapsed-in-sunbeams

Honey by Samia - https://samia.bandcamp.com/album/honey

Kathy Najimy - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kathy_Najimy

Dan Finnerty - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dan_Finnerty

Oblivion Will Own Me and Death Alone Will Love Me (Void Filler) by Short Fictions - https://shortfictions.bandcamp.com/album/oblivion-will-own-me-and-death-alone-will-love-me-void-filler

Kathy Najimy 

Hocus Pocus interview - https://www.today.com/popculture/movies/hocus-pocus-2-viral-clip-kathy-najimy-rcna51372

Episode Transcription

Captions provided by Zoom

 

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Hong Lieu: Hello and welcome to another episode of SBCC Vaquero Voices - a podcast highlighting the unique voices that comprise our campus culture, and how we're all working together to serve our students and the community at large.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: as usual, I'm joined by Co-Host to Akil Hill, and today we're honored to welcome, Jordan Killebrew to the show. Welcome, Jordan Jordan. Thank you. Thank you. This is really special. I feel so honored, and I love and appreciate you both. So thank you for your time and the opportunity.

 

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Akil Hill: Welcome to the show, Jordan. Also. Welcome, Sbcc. You've been here a few months now, so it's not like a fresh, you know, but but it's still kind of yeah. You still got. He's a veteran now he's a veteran. It's hard to say that, because there there's so many folks with 2530,

 

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Hong Lieu: you know, like it's like me trying to be a local to Santa Barbara like I don't think I'll ever cross that there so. But I feel like Jordan will get. Jordan will get to be a veteran Sbcc way before I become a local to Santa Barbara. So Jordan's feet has been in the fire.

 

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Good work, and I

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: I'm so grateful. Everybody has been so warm and welcoming and wanting to have a a connection with me. Wanting to build relationships with relationships are huge, super huge to me. And so it's been really really nice getting to know people. But it's never a dull day on this campus, never which is is exciting honestly for me. II don't like being bored, and so it's really really nice.

 

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Hong Lieu: So you are the executive director of public affairs and communications here at the campus. Something like that is kind of the way to describe your job because you you kind of have to kind of be in the mix of everything, and also kind of you have to be. Know when to be a guiding force. You have know when you'd be to be supporting force. But you're always there. It just seems like you always have to be like.

 

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Hong Lieu: I'm like looking out my window like, what's that about? Oh, no, let me go out. But you're not always the first line, you know. Like, if you have to go out. You're not always necessarily the first line of communication. But you know your personal strength in terms of building. You talk about building relationships and communicate, you know, like II feel like your personal skills are really well suited to the job. So we are really happy to have you here on campus, and we're excited

 

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Hong Lieu: that you're here, and you know. And and we're just yeah, you know.

 

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Akil Hill: absolutely. I mean, I've known Jordan Jordan prior to Sbcc. And it's it's like a it's such a perfect fit. We're so honored and and appreciative that you're here on this Campus Jordan. You bring so many different layers to this institution. And so I was super excited when I heard the news. And so, yeah, man, welcome to the family.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: II will say it does feel like a good fit. And I work several multiple jobs. And this feels really nice. And we have an amazing team. Of course, Hong's on our team. In the office of communications. But even across campus everybody that I'm meeting they're really passionate about students, and that's you know our North Star, and that's what we're here for. I'm grateful to have this opportunity.

 

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Hong Lieu: Yep, a shout out to our our other teammate, Amanda Jacobs Gerson, I mean the to the true, the true dream team like cause. That's the thing everyone talks about working with students. I barely work directly with students. I mean, students use the websites I can always use as as a crutch. But in terms of me working directly with students, it's like

 

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Hong Lieu: point 0 0 1%. So II do. You know, students are the North Star. Education is important. But I I'm very detached from that. So I mean, folks like Amanda Kirsten, you Jordan, I mean, you're much better at building those relationships and kind of creating that kind of team identity of

 

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Hong Lieu: public and voice communications. We are department in the school, but we really are here for student and staff and faculty as well. But you all are the ones actually going out and building those like one to ones. I I'm kind of in the background, like when an email comes in, I get excited like that's not true. You are a huge connector on this campus. Everybody that I talked to is like Hong is amazing.

 

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Hong Lieu: Well, the emails, though I answer the emails, I fix stuff, you know, like my work, my work does does the heavy lifted for me, and I appreciate that's that's I appreciate that part of of the deal where, if I you know, they remember that. So that's that's that's always nice. But yes, our team. Amanda's amazing person's amazing. We are the heart of the campus, because everything kind of comes to us

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: at some point or another, and so working with somebody from departments. We're here, or our office door. I remember when I first came to this office. It's like black lives matter like in translate, like matter, like everything's here on this, on this window, saying, please come in. You're welcome, inclusive, and II have to credit you, Hong and Amanda and person for making this

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: beautiful little office so warm and welcoming, and just kind of lovely. It's really delightful. So so while you're still still getting your sea legs down, I mean, I don't want to press you too much. But I'm I'm curious if you have kind of

 

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Hong Lieu: in the back of your mind, or you have, or or even orders from, you know, superintendent, president, or wherever else do you have kind of like a a mandate, or things like a little, a little to do list, or just kind of priorities for your first, maybe year. I mean, I guess I guess that's almost like, what do? What do you plan for your first year office, or something like, that's like a politician question. But do you have any sort of like things like that you're thinking of, or kind of

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: mind when you think about yeah, what? What you feel like getting accomplished. I have a lot of of things that actually, I'll be working closely with lots of campus departments to talk about our, my Sbcc implementation strategy, which is hopefully, hopefully making sense of all the things that we do here on campus and so, for example, we have a vision. We have a mission. We have a stretch strategic plan that's going to be voted on on Thursday by our board. How does that actually play out.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: And for me, it's looking at. Okay, in order for us to communicate. Externally, we have to work internally. I'm always about, you know, self awareness. And what's going on on our campus. And for me, a goal is to bring stability, especially at this administrative level. But also looking at our organizational culture.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: How can we really look at our last 10 years that have been tumultuous and changes and leadership? Racism so much has happened on this campus. And how do we vent that? How do we address it? Cause addressing? It's still ongoing, and it still continues.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: How do we heal like healing. This campus needs so much healing because every conversation that I've had I've noticed that we get stuck and we're not able to move forward, and I think we have to actually just address that head on. So the organizational culture is a huge piece for me, because I want people. And this is why that my Sbcc campaign is so important? Because the my part of that campaign is taking autonomy for this place, and having a sense of belonging to this place.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: and hopefully bringing us all together as a team to move forward. So it's kind of a

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: a plan that I put together. It's actually a 5 year plan. That I hope to share with the campus community very soon. Because I think what we need is is that healing that love? And then moving forward. How do we? Where do we go from here? Cause I think it's only up, really, for my opinion.

 

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Hong Lieu: Yeah, cause you know, in terms of we. We've spent a lot of time. We've worked on policies and procedures. We've got a lot of things written down, and and the way things are written. You know you talk about mission vision statement, statement, everything is there in terms of on the page in terms of our our hearts are in the right place. Our intentions are there.

 

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Hong Lieu: That that missing piece is exactly what you're describing, you know, in terms of that. Taking that, those those words and the policy and philosophy, and translating that into some sort of actionable element. And it's something that is is been kind of an elusive target. It's it's a tough. It's a tough thing to do, and it's something that we touched upon in our episode with Superintendent President. You know Erica Andrew Jonas Dr. Erica, where she was. The the problems that community colleges face

 

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Hong Lieu: used to be something that was able to be kind of reasonably handled in house, but now involve resources from outside of our, you know, building where we have to lean on the county, really on the city, we need, we need it to be a really holistic kind of effort. And the things that you're talking about feel like those kind of big issues where we're gonna we can do our best in and of in and of us ourselves. You know the my Sbc aspect of it. But we also need that external help, and we need that

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: collaboration and coordination. So it's it's definitely not an easy task. It's not. It's a heavy lift. But I mean, II do feel glad that you're the one you know, kind of helping.

 

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Hong Lieu: See this through and shepherd this along honestly, because, yeah, I mean

 

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Hong Lieu: people. You need people with that experience of turning thought and and philosophy and idea into action, and, you know, measurable quantitative output and circumstances and stuff. So it's it's something that you've actually done. The community you have. You have experience with that in terms of billing those relationships and kind of bridging things together. And you just yeah, we'll see how it goes. II you know I'm optimistic, for sure. But I

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: thanks. Well, you know. And

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: yes, I might be the person that's probably championing this, but I really am going to be asking for everyone on this campus to help support like it's all of us. And like you said, it's even the external community that we have in our district from Gavio to Carpenteria. For me the healthiest communities are multi-generational and multigenerational in a sense, that there's a sharing of information.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: And I wanna break these silos. So that way we can share information and be healthier.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: That's really what we're looking at. It's just making our healthier community. And I think Sbcc is strategically placed to do that internally and externally.

 

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Akil Hill: Yeah.

 

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Akil Hill: you know, I was gonna you know, I was listening to you talking. I thought it made me think about literally your your team, right? Because you talk about the different sharing of ideas or different cultures. And and you and your whole department is just that it's so diverse in so many different ways. And so

 

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Akil Hill: if you can take the diversity from your team and actually implement it onto campus. I mean, we're definitely gonna win. You know, we're definitely gonna win. I think we're definitely been trending in the right direction. I know that your your team is amazing. They did an amazing job with us with the black grad last year. So you have to definitely give them shots out to that. So yeah, I'm I'm all for what's what pouring into? What's you know? I mean, into what you're doing, Jordan.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: Well, thank you. Thank you.

 

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Hong Lieu: And and it's one of those things where, if I it's initially gonna be tough, cause a lot of people don't want. I mean it. Some people aren't used to being a part of the conversation, even hearing about what people are talking about like, I'm a perennial kids table Guy, I'm put me at the kids table. I don't wanna hear what the grownups talking about, cause they're always talking some mess that doesn't have anything to do with me. And I was not my problem. So I'm perennial kids table guy. But in terms of

 

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Akil Hill: actually having these conversations, yeah, even even a person, even someone like me is gonna eventually step up every now, at least, at least, you know, lead an ear in and see what's going on. I don't even think it's gonna be tough, because I feel that this institution needs leadership. And that's what it's kinda been like wanting. And we just gotta get the right leaders in the right spots. And III have no doubt that that's what I see in Jordan. And so I think people are gonna be like, really.

 

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Akil Hill: you know, embodying what you know, what I mean, picking up what you're putting down. I don't think it's gonna be. That's my personal opinion.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: Thank you. That's that really brings me up. I've already had conversations with Academic Senate steering Committee and with, you know, the Executive Committee. And I've gotten positive feedback already. And so it's just gonna be rolling this out and making sure that we remain consistent. And people can identify themselves in this implementation plan like they can see. Oh, this is where I can contribute or this is where I'm getting recognized. Cause a lot of it is actually just recognition

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: and honoring the good work that people have been doing. And so it's really just trying to align that. And you know, be a spokesperson in the voice for it.

 

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Hong Lieu: and that really encapsulates the mission of our office on our ways, highlighting the good work that people are doing, you know, getting getting the word out being a being a spokesperson for for all the things that the campus has going on so big, shout out to the the team. You know, Amanda Kirsten. They're really good about getting press releases social media because there is a lot going on on campus. It's one of those things where there's so many things that even we're not able to get coverage of that I mean on a day to day basis. This, this campus really is a a pillar of the community in terms of of how? How.

 

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Hong Lieu: we, where, where we fit in in that piece for education, for for the youth and the community. And and we try to do our best to to show that on social media press releases and stuff. And I think we do a great job with the resources we have. But yeah, just just knowing that not only do are we covering what's going on, but we're also missing amazing things as well, which is, you know, we're apologies. We do the best we can. But at the same time that's a shout out to Sbcc as an institution. Yeah.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: all the things that they've got cooking, all the things that we got cooking in terms of basic needs and various all the clubs on campus and is, there's a lot going on. And and we we provide a lot, and it's good that good to shine that light. So it is. I'm I am just trying to grasp that our office created an outreach calendar of, like all the community events that are happening, you know, externally, but also what's happening on campus. And like.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: it's extremely long. And I know enrollment services adding stuff, the foundations adding, stuff, and it's just like, Wow, we are actually really everywhere. And I don't think people really

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: often see that. And so it's like again, how can we be better and getting that information out? But it is overwhelming because we are everywhere. It's amazing, like, even today, I was working out. And I saw our ad on the bus drive by. And I'm like, we literally are just everywhere. And II appreciate all the work that this office does in this community does.

 

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Hong Lieu: Yeah. So

 

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Hong Lieu: I mean that work is always ongoing. It never ends it. It's it's always a a moving target, so to speak. But I mean again, we're we're happy to have you here at the helm, Jordan running the show, and and and a voice on campus

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: how you got here segwaying along to what brought you to Spcc. So how you go as far back as you want. If you want to do it. You know this is your life or anything. But yeah, I mean, II always have to give credit when credit is due. I'm a product of my mom from the Bronx, New York, and my dad from Compton, California.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: and their story, their trauma. Their history is my story. They met in Riverside, California, at Loma, Linda University. They both grew up, and happiness families there.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: both still kind of religious. And yeah, that's they. They met in college first generation, college students, at an abandon institution and then fell in love. Had my brother and then myself. And so big black families on both sides. My mom has 10 siblings. My dad had

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: 5 siblings and

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: just growing up. It was just always people, always people, every Sabbath we were in church. And yeah. And I guess for me it was. It was.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: I always knew I was different. I didn't. I was always creating community because I felt like the church community wasn't really for me. Of course I knew I was. I was, you know, Gay and II just knew I was different. And the church wasn't really affirming of that culture.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: And so it was interesting navigating that because I was a really quiet kid. But it wasn't until Ucsb that I felt like I could start

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: being myself if that makes sense. And at first I actually really didn't like Ucsb, because it was so different than my upbringing. I was kind of sheltered a lot

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: But then I got a job as a resident assistant, and that was

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: the best job ever absolutely loved everything about it, because I got to create my own community. And I remember I sat them down their first

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: first meeting, and I was like, this is your family. Now, if I see anybody, and I with vista like if I hear if anybody gets like left like it's gonna be me at your door like this. You have each other's back, and they took that seriously, like they are all still friends now, like II go hang out with them in La all the time a couple of them have gotten married. They're now having babies. And so

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: it was the best job. Because I was able to take my experience of being a first year and second year, and not really liking this place and being like well, maybe it's because I haven't actually put the work into this place to make me like it. And I was able to translate that and make an experience better for my first year.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: Students. And so, yeah, and so my career has been working at Ucsb. As our assistant resident director. I did a lot of consulting as a student I was art major, and so I built websites. And I did logos, because there's always campus clubs that need them.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: And so in my head, I was basically building a network. And that's one of my my professor says, like, you start networking. Now start networking. Now. You don't know who's gonna end up, where and what and what? And so

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: yeah, so I consulted for a little bit.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: a lot of me being a resident assistant. Meant, I met a lot of people and had a lot of

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: folks that still lived in Iowa Vista during the time of the 2,014 shootings, and so I just will never forget that night when couple of my former residents called me and was like, Hey, we need a place to stay. We just heard gunshots. We don't feel safe.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: And so I was living downtown, Santa Barbara at the time. I told them. Just come, stay with me, and I don't know if you'll remember. But that night was there was no information anywhere like you can like. I was like on news talk. I was on nothing, you know. Saturday morning. We're on Cnn.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: We're like, we're like plastered everywhere. It was like there was helicopters. It was insane, and all I remember is all my friends that you know, gauchos from all over. We're calling me because I knew I still live in Santa Barbara. They're like, what's going on. This is too close to home. Why is this happening? How is this happening?

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: And

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: me like? I said, I don't like to be bored. I was just like, well, we have to do something. And so we I started project I would still love, which we started fundraising to kind of remember to remember the victims that were lost. The 6 couches, and also kind of have a reminder to

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: not let this happen in this community again. And so in a year we raise 50,000 and build a park. Called out this 11 Members garden that's currently still in Augusta. And man manage by alabaster parks and Recs. You chat up to them. They do a great job. And

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: that kind of was my entry into philanthropy in this region.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: And so the Santa Barbara Foundation, help contribute to my campaign. Saw what I was doing, and a communications job kind of popped up. And they're like you should apply. And I was like, okay, whatever I was still consulting at the time. And I did. And that was an amazing experience to work at a community foundation for the county

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: and also really good entry into what philanthropy looks like. And I was there for 7 years. And Comms capacity director of communications. And that experience

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: towards the end of it. I was getting weary to pull in to be in this region, and we can talk about that later, because it's

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: it's interesting. The concept of philanthropy in itself. But I then for a short stand for 9 months worked with supervisor caps. As for communications director of accounting, and got to learn that landscape

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: and then now I'm here. And I have always been looking at this position because was in it. And I was like, that's an interesting position. I've always loved college campuses like like I said I was an Ra and when that position opened up I got a little note from somebody that was like you should apply and I was like, okay. And then I applied and didn't hear anything. And I was like, Okay, well, maybe I'm not it. But

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: then they hired Erica, and next thing I know in August there is like a whirlwind of of interviews. And then, by the end of August I was. I was brought on, and fortunate to have the position and

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: when I found out I did cry. I like literally broke down and crying because I, in an interview process, you do a lot of research, at least for me. I do a lot of research, and I do you know my due diligence to make sure that the people that I'm around because it's more than 40 HA week like we spend a lot of time here on this campus.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: Is the right move. Because I've been in positions where it was not the right move, and I needed to make that change. But I really really wanted it. Because I felt like I have energy to help this campus and bring my expertise to make it better.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: so yeah, I am so grateful to be here, and I'm really excited and energized about this place and about what we can do, collectively

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: sorry. That was a long history of acknowledging, and we can feel free to add questions. So if you have questions, please ask but yeah, I have to start with my parents. Because they sacrifice a lot for me and my brother.

 

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Hong Lieu: we we're definitely gonna dive in a little bit. But first off being an Ra. A Ucsb. And trying to keep folks away from iv the temp the temptations, I mean mitigating that, keeping them away completely. But you find that moderate moderation point. I mean that that's that's a tall task. My philosophy was, you all are, gonna do it. But you all better go together and have each other's backs like like, don't leave each other at a party. Be careful what you you're drinking. Be careful of your surroundings.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: But if I hear that that somebody's left at a party.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: it's gonna be me at your door like, we're gonna have a long conversation about that, because that's not gonna fly

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: and they they respected that like there wasn't ever any issues of of leaving anybody behind. And so that was really important to me.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: Because you you hear the stories and you see them, and I've seen them as an Ra. You know, alcohol poisoning and their friends just left the person at this party. And it's just kinda like what is going on here. That's not okay, and so building that community was so important to me. And then they they just took it to the next level, like they all like hang out every weekend in la, like the books that live in la like they like. We just went to a friend's giving with them. They they really love each other, and I love them too.

 

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Hong Lieu: Yes, I got my my demo, my dad say you do whatever you want, but just don't get caught, cause if you get caught to ask cause, and that's and that's the thing where it's like, you can make up whatever mechanism, whatever process you need to not get caught. And and it also is a part of that is not doing anything so crazy that you're guaranteed to get caught because there is a level of like, yeah, you're gonna matter what? So that that whole idea of like giving them that autonomy to make make their way in the world. But also, knowing that there are boundaries there, do not cross these boundaries.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: That's that's that's which is easier said than done. It's easy to tell somebody use common sense. What is common sense in this world today, you know, for real.

 

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Hong Lieu: And then the other thing I wanted to say really, is.

 

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Hong Lieu: your story is a good message for a lot of folks, because you, if you feel like you didn't really come into your own or find yourself in a way until you got to Ucsb.

 

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Hong Lieu: and I think we put a lot of pressure on ourselves as young kids. I know I did. Personally, you know, like, you really feel like everyone feels like Oh, by junior high, you better by high school, and and not being far away remuner, for now is different. But at the time, every day, every month, every year of those teenage years feels like an attorney like, when is it gonna click? When is it gonna happen like you get impatient with yourself.

 

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Hong Lieu: and that even and even going into college and beyond, like, I feel like up to your mid to late twenties. People are still really really hard on themselves that they should be farther along, or they should have found themselves. They should know what they wanna do with the rest of their lives. And it's just. Life is just. Not that life is really about

 

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Hong Lieu: the reason education is so important in your life is because you're going to be learning, probably for the rest of your life.

 

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Hong Lieu: And it's it's something where we I don't know where we got that. I mean, it's probably from like teen movies and stuff like that. But at the same time, I mean, who knows? But we really put a lot of pressure on ourselves as young people when it's really the best, I mean really is like the best time we rely from a physical perspective. I mean a A in intellectually you still have a lot to learn. And you know, like like you, there's a reason the old you, the the in the martial arts movies. The young person always has to go to the person like the 80 foot beard in the mountains

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: to learn to learn to learn the ultimate lesson, because intellectually you're not there yet, but from a physical, you know. Perspective. II mean, it's it's it's the time. It's the, you know, peak of your life. And and you should be enjoying yourself more than we do, but it's that pressure and that that desire to be farther along.

 

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Hong Lieu: I really, I mean, it's good when it drives you, but it's also it also can be a detriment when it really puts too much pressure on you, and and really kind of presses you into situations. And it's good that you gave yourself that grace

 

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Hong Lieu: to be like, hey? I mean, you know, I mean, maybe in the moment you didn't give yourself, but you're aware. But in hindsight. And now we can send that message along like, Hey, you know, if you're 2425, you don't got it together. That's okay. If you're 2829, you still feel a little lost. That's normal, you know. 32, 33.

 

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Hong Lieu: Okay? II mean 38, 39. You still get locked up in the drunk tech. We got some problems, anything beyond that, I mean, come on, we have to give ourselves that grace, especially in the world we're in today. That is just really, you know, leaps and bounds exponentially more complex

 

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Hong Lieu: than our parents world, our grandparents world. It's not complex in terms of what's going on. It's more complex than what we get to see. We've we peek behind the curtain many curtains that have were never open before. We even had conversations that we've never had before with, you know, between generations. So please, I'm just asking, you know, listeners and everyone. Please give yourself that grace to find yourself and just allow yourself room to to to have that journey, you know.

 

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Akil Hill: Well, you know, I was, gonna think I that's so. You're so right in so many ways. Hong. Yeah. I was having conversation last night with my daughter. You know she's

 

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Akil Hill: a second year student here. Really great gpa,

 

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Akil Hill: and you know she's applying to schools, and she's like

 

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Akil Hill: she's like, well, she's talking about winter class. She may get an a minus. And so I'm like, how do you feel because I'm her. Gpa, she's a 4 point. Oh, student, she's like man. I'm not even worried about that. And then I'm like, I was like what I'm like. It's gonna be a minus. She's like

 

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Akil Hill: she's like, I'm not gonna lose sleep over getting the a minus. And then so then we start talking about like schools. And then she's like, well, I'm gonna apply. And wherever I get in I get in and it. If I don't get in, I'm not gonna lose any sleep over it.

 

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Akil Hill: Totally radical way of different way of thinking. You know. I mean, she's like I'm gonna get into where I'm gonna get in, and then I'll make my decision based upon where I get it.

 

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Akil Hill: It's totally different. Generational man.

 

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Akil Hill: I love that. That's amazing, you know. So one thing I want to highlight about you join soon. And I think it's it's definitely important for our here is to kind of sit with this. And

 

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Akil Hill: one of the things I really just admire you for, just kind of going through through your journey and sharing with us. But the fact that you know you're residing as the Director of Communications at Santa Barbara City College. But the fact that you're probably the first black person in this role at Sbcc. And you're act, you know, one of the also, probably from I from I've been here for 20 years. I haven't seen anyone that's been

 

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Akil Hill: black as well as openly gay. And I just commend you for that strength and bringing that into the space. Because

 

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Akil Hill: I mean, it's just like we talk about generation right now, just a few minutes ago, the fact that people are out and say, This is me who this is, who I am is really empowering. And so, you know, hopefully, the listeners. Some of the students are listening to this, and they can kinda re relate to that. And being like, Yeah, I can. That's that's what I wanna do. That's how I want to live my life. That's how I that's who I want to be like. So thanks for just owning that, and being just straight candid with our listeners, I appreciate you for that.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: Oh, well, thank you. This is such nice things, and kind of to encompass what I'm saying. Of course, what you were saying until  grace is important. But in in my coming out story it was not every day was that, but it was and I knew that I needed to be authentic, and every every

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: decision I make was needed to be authentic to me. And that would make me feel okay with myself. And that's something that I just, you know. every opportunity. Everything that comes my way is just like, how do I feel about this? Is this what I want is, does this align with who I am? And asking myself and questioning myself, so much so that I can really get to the core of who I am. And every day isn't perfect.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: But

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: it's really important to me that II just be me and and what I've learned is that I have so much peace in that like there's so much peace that comes with it. And I'm grateful for that. And II honor that because I don't. I really don't have time for drama number one. But I just I really I have lots of goals that I want to achieve. I just know that

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: as long as I be me and I do my best, because I really just wanna do a good job and help people it'll be all right. But thank you. Thank you both. You are so kind.

 

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Hong Lieu: And that's really the biggest moving target of all is be talk about being authentic yourself, I mean, during High School Junior High. We're we're moving Tarcus. We're trying to get in with this, this click, that click, this we're we're listening to this because someone told you it was good watching this movie cause. They thought it was good doing this cause. They said it was the way to do it. And and you really lose sight of yourself because you're still feeling things out. You're still getting a feel for the world around you, and to to take all that information in. Take all that data in and figure out, what do you really want me

 

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Hong Lieu: in? And of myself? What? What do just I want? I mean, it's very difficult. And it's something that I didn't get

 

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Hong Lieu: until until I was almost done with college, and then I figured out exactly who I was and what I wanted, cause I was still curious. You know that curiosity killed the cat? I mean it. Def. There was definitely some situations that I put myself in that I shouldn't have, but it was one of the things where I was still feeling things out. And that's that's that kind of balance that give and take of. We want people to find their most authentic self. But, like you said about drama, you know, nobody's really good with drama. People chase that stuff because they think it makes them a better, like a hardier person like

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: no one's about that live. It's it's stressful. And stress is the the true mind killer, you know. So let's let's let's avoid that when we can. That part of stress is, not only a mindkiller, but a lot of cause of just like health issues like we need to like, really address like stress and of itself and stress management. Because I know we've moved into a time where we can talk about therapy. We can talk about all these other things. But actually, let's break down stress management.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: And how do we cope with that?

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: But the you know, students these days have social media, and there's so much content that is just coming their way. That for me. II I'm trying to get back into the practice of just like turning off my phone one day at the weekend, like I like to call it screen free Sundays, just so that I can have that mental clarity, instead of just looking at Instagram or Tiktok and stuff like that. So yeah, II thank you for saying that, Hong. I really hope that folks can

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: just find that authenticity for themselves. It's really important. Are you legit screen free all day? I try. I really, because it's it's not. It forces me to just go outside or read a book like, Do something different. And then tell my community that, like my, of course, my husband and other people like, Hey, I'm not. I'm off.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: Walk it, walk it like you talk it. That's exactly it. I'm I'm I'm working on it. I definitely couldn't do it. Full disclosure. Yeah, within within 20 min. I've hit the screen. So it's it's the gift is the gift that technology is giving us. We have to. We have to make the most of it.

 

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Hong Lieu: Oh, yeah, so yeah, thank thank you for all that. I mean, so much, so much knowledge and wisdom in that story right there. And that's why that's why we love sharing these stories with our listeners and just letting people know you know

 

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Hong Lieu: that that you. You are now the executive director, fully formed human Jordan Kilobreu, but you did not, and that's really important.

 

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Hong Lieu: It it comes for us all. III am. I love the belief that we all get there. It's there's no one that that doesn't eventually get there just different times for different folks. You might be 50 60. That's okay, you know, like, I feel like we shouldn't put pressure on this. It has to happen by X amount of time, because it's, you know, we at the gift of humanities. We are all individuals, you know, like we 6, 6, 7 billion of us by.

 

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Hong Lieu: you know, with the next decade, and we we are we we gotta

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: right. I remember my grandfather. It was everything he was like

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: what anything like. I'm learning something new every day, that is life. And I was just like, Oh, wow! I just got oh, oh, you're still okay, like in that, I think, having that story like that experience really changed my mind of like, I just need to be constantly learning

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: like II need to be curious. I need to continue to be curious

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: and that was really helpful for me. And so yeah, I'm grateful for this. This podcast because, II think sharing people's stories is so important. Storytelling is so important. So

 

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Hong Lieu: and you know, you touch on something that I'm not like. I'm just talking big talk about not putting a deadline and not putting a number on things I feel like learning how to learn. You should, I mean, don't brushing yourself again. I'm trying to be that I'm trying to walk it like a talking, don't. But you should really put a put emphasis on learning how you learn best as an individual, find your true authentic self

 

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Hong Lieu: is also finding out how you learn best and how you learn, because what we've established is that learning is a lifelong thing. You you should. You will be learning new things throughout your entire life, and if you're not open to the process of learning and retaining information and utilizing it in daily practice, or or to, you know. Then then what's the point? So like that? That is something II remember really clicking when I was in college in college for me, and I'm not saying that college is what it that has to be for everybody.

 

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Hong Lieu: But you know it could come later earlier. But really, college clicked where IA lot of things came easier easy for me in high school and earlier, where I wasn't really learning. I was just kind of

 

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Hong Lieu: going through the motions, and I was able to host. But college was really difficult for me. And and there was a point where it just clicked like, okay.

 

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Hong Lieu: this is how I actually learn and gain knowledge and and take in things that people are giving me. Because that was the problem was, I was like understanding in the moment, but I was not retaining so to retain knowledge and wisdom.

 

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Hong Lieu: and and it was really kind of I mean it. It. II realize I required some things that were a little unorthodox and neglecting. But you know, like knowing that and understanding, I mean, it's gonna be different for everybody. So just again. That's another great point is that you know. Learn who your most authentic self learn, learn who you are as yourself, and also learn how you learn best and just take those with, because those 2 2 things will carry the rest of your life for sure.

 

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Akil Hill: Yeah, I mean, I'll I'll just throw this last thing, and and also, too, like, I'm thinking about that point about, you know. I really believe, like like what Jordan was saying, like he knew something

 

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Akil Hill: that at a young age, that that was different from what he's seen and what I would want to tell. The listeners are tuning the students out are out here listening

 

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Akil Hill: like sometimes you have to follow that.

 

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Akil Hill: because sometimes, when you run from what your your intuition is telling you, it causes a lot of harm. So sometimes you have to be able to listen to that. And then also the pieces. Sometimes you just gotta go through it right. That's just the reality. Sometimes you gotta like. If, in order to eat good barbecue, you gotta make a lot of bad barbecue. And so and that's the seasoning. So when you like, when Jordan is saying when he's talking to

 

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his his grandfather, he's like, and I remember having that same

 

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Akil Hill: feeling about my grandfather is like, Wow! You must know everything. It's because when you're young your mind is thinking like the experiences that people go through at it that are older that they know everything, cause they've experienced so much more and but the truth in the matter is like, I guess it's the wisdom, right like you're gonna know a lot if you're wise to it. But if you're not really trying to steep yourself and

 

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Akil Hill: wisdom, then maybe you you know, you're still trying to find your way through. But my point in all of it is just listen to your intuition, because sometimes we second guess that.

 

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Akil Hill: and that you know what I mean and that that that

 

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Akil Hill: Ca can cause a lot of hurt to to circle all the way back around and to follow that because it's that's a real thing.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: 1,000 I like. I talked about Ucsb and my first year my first year. I of course my family didn't really have the means to send me to college. So I was working 3 jobs. I was actually a pre bio major, and I just found myself either working or studying or going out and partying.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: and what I found was. I was in the culture, being busy and not actually addressing what I needed to do, and being authentic to myself, I was just like, Go go, go, go, go, go. And I'm like, Okay, I'm still getting C's and D's on my my grades. I'm still getting not doing what II need to do what's going on. And I was on academic quarter at Ucsb.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: And I remember getting my report card and being like I'm putting in all this work and what's going on. And inside of me. I was like, I have a lot of work that I need to do just internally.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: And what I did is, you know, I ended up taking loans. But I actually just like quick couple of my jobs and started to focus on me and started to focus on wellness. And I found my grades turnaround. I found all these other things turnaround. But I also found like

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: this, Major's not for me

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: like I need to change my major. I need to do all like it was a lot of work and trying to just work to be again that often to itself.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: so that I can be my best. And then once I found that that group that also kind of aligned when I started to get engaged more with Ucsb. And college campus and it's still an ongoing like, I say, every day. II do my best and that's all I can do, and I'm proud of myself for that. But I want to share that story because it it's working at. It's like you're chain looking at. Your environment is also something that you need.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: you know, analyze and assess. And is this working for me, and at the time when my freshman year was not, and I was really just needed to do you know, change it. I was doing too much I was like present in my my hall. I was. I was just like doing it all, and was like, no, you need to take care of yourself, Bro, like you're doing too much.

 

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Hong Lieu: Yeah. And going back to what a kill said about following your intuition. When you sometimes you go against your intuition. It hurt? I mean, it hurts the circle around you. But you feel like you betrayed yourself, you know. Like, yeah, you you those are the big regrets. And most people like. Oh, I never have any regrets, but if you ever betrayed your intuition, it's definitely in the back of your head always. So you like, oh, man, I so much good of yeah, for sure. So

 

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Hong Lieu: thank you, Jordan. Very thanks, Jordan. Lightning. Insightful path at Sbcc. We're glad you're here.

 

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Hong Lieu: But Segway and along next section. Good eating food section, talking to keel, bringing up good barbecuers, a bad barbecue. But any meal you either ate somewhere prepared yourself recently or throughout your life, you want to share with us. Kick us off.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: So big families mean, especially in the black community, means everything's around food.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: And my mom's sisters. There's 7 of them they could throw down, and like the heart like it was, it was amazing. So soul food is really where my heart goes. I love all types of soul food, especially Mac and cheese. And

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: when I have time I like to take my mom and my aunts recipes and I kind of mixed it together to make my own Mac and cheese. I'll have to make it for you both at some point. But I put cheese. It's in it. And I remember my aunt was like

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: exploring.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: Yeah, II like to bake. I like to cook. My partner likes to to bake during actually, before the pandemic. We all took a class with his parents. On making sourdough bread, and of course the pandemic hit, and then everybody was like into it, but he still does it like he makes like 2 loaves a week. And it's really good. He's like perfected it. And so it's always nice to have that fresh loaf of bread during the week.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: But yeah, we love to cook. We love to. We also love to go out and eat santa Barbara was an interesting town. With food, in my opinion. I have a friend that works in the the food industry.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: No offense in your restaurant sometimes, he says, like, you know, a lot of restaurants in in Santa Barbara, kind of like a upscale Applebee's, and I'm like.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: but there are good restaurants here, too, but that that hearing that from the industry person that works here at Dan. I was like, Oh, yeah, okay, there's some truth to that cheese. It's cheeses in the Mac, and cheese is a great hack, because, you know, breadcrumbs, or they have sometimes will be like the Parmesan on top. That texture change is is important, but she just add that texture change with that little extra cheese that pop cause I love the flavor of cheesy crackers. I mean there, this is really good, and it's like

 

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Hong Lieu: it was always like the healthy alternative like, why, you snagging again when I was growing up like. But they're baked, not fried. I could be like, I love these like chips, but they're not as bad. But if I eat a whole box, then then at the point is mood. I think I've neutralized my own point because I shouldn't be in that whole box right there. That's why I can't have potato chips in our house, because I will eat the whole bag like I will just go like I will not be able to stop, cause they're so good. Same with Jesus.

 

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Akil Hill: hey? But I'm gonna even. I'm gonna give everyone an out, though, because I feel like potato chips nowadays when you go buy a bag. That's not enough chips in the bag, like y'all remember, like during like the eighties in in the in the nineties like chips. The bags are full. Now you you bust out. The open is like 3 force air. You see the air like about the bag.

 

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Hong Lieu: so I will say there probably is a conspiracy play, because, you know, they stuck about like the shrink flashing where the size of things shrinks, but they also probably had, like cause, the errors to protect the chips from breaking in the bag on in transit, so they probably cause they always have that number in the back. If you got any questions or comments, please call. I bet you they had some just disgusting Karen's calling, and be like I bought this bag of chips, and 60% of them are broken. It's nothing but crumbs, so they just like will add more air. We'll add more air like.

 

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Hong Lieu: And then finally, they got a point where now we're just calling plenty about how many chips are in the bag. We'll take that over breakage. But no, you're probably right. It's probably it's probably more about just just sticking it to us. Because, yeah, you ain't line. It's like it's less than half the bag. Most bag of chips I open now, especially the fancy ones. My wife will come back like Whoa! These baggage chips I got like open up like what the and I got more dip left, and I got Chips still there.

 

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Akil Hill: absolutely.

 

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Akil Hill: I you know, I was thinking about a couple of things, but I think, since it's around the holiday season, and it's not even really a a plug for a restaurant in town. But one of my favorite things around this time of year that I love to really eat is pomegranates.

 

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Akil Hill: and I just I'm a big fan, everyone knows, like the the properties found they high antioxidants and stuff like that. But this time of year I just loved

 

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Akil Hill: to just buy as many as I can. You know my wife probably hates me because I don't co crack more peel them, you know, is she? And she usually does that because she has, like the science behind how to actually peel a pomegranate, because I think there, there are ways there are hacks about how to get it out without like.

 

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Akil Hill: You know what I mean staining everything in the kitchen, right? So she's kinda like the the master of doing that. But this is the time of year where you know the fall and the winter months are just really just just a special time in regards to me and and pogrants, and just being really intentional about eating seasonal fruit and and so that's my! That's my ma. That's my plug for the week.

 

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Akil Hill: Get your fix of pomegranates. I the funny thing is

 

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Akil Hill: culturally like, you know. We eat a lot of Persian food just because, you know, my father-in-law's Persian. But so there's always a affinity, a natural love for pomegranates, because it's you know it's there. One of the popular dish that uses pomegranate. It's called fuss in June.

 

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Akil Hill: It's a a famous Persian dish, but this type of year is just like it's just special for me around pomegranates. I love going places and seeing them out and stuff. It's just I'm being a little bit nostalgic here, but that's that's my that's my pick for the week. Get your pomegranates on y'all

 

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Akil Hill: and if you need a hack you can talk to Roxanne in equity, she can tell you how to to cut them open and and peel him right? Because or you probably can Youtube it.

 

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Hong Lieu: But but that's my, that's my pick for the week. Man, get your pomegranates on your body will thank you with all the antioxidants, and insane, healthy. So that's you got. That's my pick on. That was like the first super food that I really got into is pomegranates, because, like most super foods, like broccoli and Spanish foods, I also like, but pomegranates are like easy to eat, tasty, and and just like, really, really good for you. And my mom is actually

 

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Hong Lieu: she's she's kinda like Russian, where she we used to crack them open stains everywhere. My mom's like screw you all I had to clean up y'all messes. So she just now, when we come home and see her, she's got pomegranate seeds in a Ziploc bag in the freezer. She's done all the work she's like. Just take these cause. I don't trust y'all anymore. Take this and eat. Do what you will with it. But I ain't letting you open these things up in the house anymore.

 

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Hong Lieu: Cause yeah, is they got hard shell. That's like a firm mixture. You gotta cut to get in, and then you gotta like, look like, get them out individually. I don't know if there's a trick to get them out in a big, but my mom's holding down the zip out bags, and that's my son always loves coming home for the Zipl bags from from from Ama. So

 

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Akil Hill: I also feel like, too, like II don't think we don't. I don't. I think we don't do this. Enough is like really kinda eat with our eyes. One of the things like I really like about the pomegranates is when you crack it open. And and you see, like all the little kernels kinda like stuck together. It's just pretty, you know, and and sometimes we just are been conditioned to just scour it all down, just eat it. But just to take a moment, be like, look how this has been created, and the flower that turned into a piece of fruit, and

 

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Akil Hill: you know, like I just, I feel like, you know, like we don't. We don't honor that enough.

 

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Hong Lieu: It's ultimate riddle fruit, cause II the first, I think about 8 like back in the day. First Guy saw pomegranates like first person saw, partner. What the I need to see like

 

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Hong Lieu: the seed is good, and it goes back like you won't believe you won't believe what I found. You don't need to flesh. You only need to seed like

 

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Hong Lieu: crazy ass fruit. But yeah, exactly. But it's delicious. Very good for you. So my pick for this this week is it's something that

 

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Hong Lieu: was. I've always always been on my mind but recently rediscovered with the keel. And another folks. Gene. We took her there meet up

 

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Hong Lieu: the the rest Chinese Restaurant Las Pasitas because of the holidays.

 

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Hong Lieu: you know, everyone's looking for a restaurant on Christmas. It's always gonna be an Asian restaurant. Chinese food, Japanese food. Sushi, 29 Jordan. I know you mentioned it before that you love that place. They let me know they're gonna be open on Christmas. So places like that are gonna be sushi 29 is a and anap. Yeah.

 

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Hong Lieu: but meet up the the it would. Evidently II got to know the owner because I've been back a few times a keel knows this as well that that we we pull, we pull up. They're like, Hey, what's up Hong? How you doing? I found out the Guy's name is Hong as well. He's like your name is all my name. I'm like I have never II don't meet that many other hong's in my life, you know, a lot of them are a lot of them are female for being, if full disclosure. But

 

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Hong Lieu: but because, you know, did different cultures. It. It definitely means the same thing. But it also is yeah. Different cultures of different naming name restrictions. But seeing a meeting of the hong of the while has been great, and it's just a great restaurant. He took it over from the person, the owner, the previous owner during the pandemic.

 

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Hong Lieu: and you know the. They've just done a great job with it.

 

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Hong Lieu: they added a robot waiter, which is, you know, a just in and of itself, even if you don't like the food having a having a robot bring the food to you is kind of interesting, but beyond that it's just a really good Chinese food, and they really good Chinese food, and they got some really authentic dishes, so I gotta shout them out and get and get them out there, cause they they deserve the extra pump, although I went on a Friday night recently and they were packed, I had to get the food to go cause all the tables were full.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: and my wife is still Covid Covid, like sensitive. So she's like, I can't eat it here. I'm like, all right. Fine. So. But yeah is all on the weekends. They're packed. But but most nights you be able to grab a table. No problem. And yeah.

 

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Hong Lieu: great hospitality. And and and Hong is the man I should take a picture for the show notes cause the day that he told me his name was Hong. I got well a fortune cookie, and the fortune, you know, on the back of the learn Chinese. And the word was hong for the fortune, too. Yeah. So II showed him that he's like, Whoa! And I was like, lucky man, so lucky I had a I had to put out my Chinese voice. Real good. So lucky. Hi, yeah, he's like, Yeah.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: hey? No, no, no. I got support. Small business. III pay full price. And I tip. Well, so yeah, that place actually is really good. I've been real, quick, oh, hung! And

 

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Akil Hill: Gene, who was a the Director of International. We went and hate there. She was a guest on the on the podcast and we had the fried fish.

 

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Hong Lieu: the green beans, and we have the toothpick lamb. And it it everything was amazing. II think it's the best Chinese restaurant, Santa Barbara. Yeah, it's definitely it definitely leads towards the newer kind of popular Chinese dishes, because, you know, the Chinese food in in America is coming. Waves like, you know, it's like the

 

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Hong Lieu: the Fujian influence with the the railrokers. It was Cantonese, you know, my generation Shanghainese. And now it's more Sichuan, and you know the the the foods of the of the north, so to speak. So this is leans more towards Sichron. They do have some of the older like classic dishes. They have a a section devoted to those. So, but

 

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Hong Lieu: so if it's a little bit spicy, so a lot of folks. If you don't like spice, it's it's not all the dishes gonna be up your up your alley, but in terms of you can handle that. Or if you just wanna try some of the other stuff.

 

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Hong Lieu: it is probably the best rest. Chinese restaurant. It's it's the because they use the citro peppercorn, these citrus peppercorn, which has that mala, the numbing spice? So it's like a it feels a little strange if you're not used to that. And then they do have those like the dried chilies they put in all the Chinese food where it doesn't really add a lot of heat unless you bite into one, so that you can kind of work your way around the dish where, if you're not, you know

 

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Hong Lieu: you don't actually bite it chill, you'll be okay. But then that Mala numbing can be disorienting for some folks where it's like, what is this kind of spice? But

 

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Akil Hill: yeah, if if you can handle that, or even if you can't, because they have non spicy dishes as well, it's definitely worth trying, at least just for the robot waiter alone. Well, also to I feel the spicy. These the spiciness is is, it's not really upset your stomach spicy like. Sometimes, you know, you're thinking about like, you know, some of like

 

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Akil Hill: spicy or like Mexican food. You're like, Oh, man, that's gonna get my stomach but for some reason, like I, you know, ate pretty spicy there in my. My stomach has been pretty good every time. So, and I just think it's cause the it's the peppercorn instead of the the actual pepper. It's itself. Right? So. But yeah, man, make sure you guys do yourself a favor. It can go there. It's definitely worth it.

 

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Hong Lieu: all right.

 

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Hong Lieu: right along segway into higher learning, Jordan piece of culture. It could be anything, movie, music, book, TV,

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: recently throughout your life. Oh, recently or throughout my life. Oh, any anything? Yeah. Meaningful throughout your life, or just something you found recently that you're really in love with.

 

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I am

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: watching scavengers rain on. Max. We have former episode, me and my buddies are watching a former episode. It is

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: like Anime is already super creative and of itself, and like sometimes a little weird, but like it's supposed to push the boundaries of that. And that's why I love Anime so much. But it really is

 

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Hong Lieu: just so great, like everything like where I'm watching like what just happened like. And the storyline is fascinating. I'm glad we get a dive into this because I shattered out on the jing episode, and I and but I, but no one had seen it there. So I'm glad you've actually seen some episodes, and you can really you can dive in a little bit on. It really is

 

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Hong Lieu: probably one of the most unique animated shows I've seen in the last, you know, 1520 years. That's saying a lot, because the animation has come a long way. It's a lot more mainstream now. So you have a lot more stuff coming at you, and there's a lot a lot of different directions. People could take it, and to still be surprised.

 

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Hong Lieu: shocked, mildly disgusted by an animated show. It's it's very novel. It's it's it's unique. So it's very special to me episode into like that idea of like

 

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Hong Lieu: early settling, or, you know, colonization or habitation, like people talk about moon missions and Mars missions. And everyone's all about the space and decide how cool it's gonna be. It's gonna be

 

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Hong Lieu: Darlie and disgusting for the first. Yeah. And this really hammers home like, it's not gonna be like some reward vision. This is, gonna be difficult. And it's but yeah. And and really, that that show really tells you, yeah, just hammers home now. And and just the rules. Except for that planet, I mean, everything fits together. Everything is beautiful and frightening, and just like new. And it's just an amazing show. And animation is excellent.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: Yeah, II really appreciate that show. It's like you said, like, if they're looking for something to feel like they go to this plan. But then it turns into another thing. It's just it's really fascinating. And I'm

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: a hundred percent entertained watching it. So I'm not gonna give anything away because the journey is journey with that show is the gift for sure from beginning to end. And the very last episode I was like.

 

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Hong Lieu: Wow, they even capped it off. Well, and oh, yeah, everything. I mean not to say anything tied up in a neat little package cause there's there's so much going on, it's so much at play in terms of the back stories. How they got on the planet, how the you know all that stuff, and the the crew members that they highlight, you know, and and everything. I mean. It was just really well done it. It was a show that was picked up off of the shorts. They did, and I think the short didn't have the full fleshing out of the storyline, but the the them expanding. It has. I mean, they really did. It's just a unbelievable

 

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like, I said.

 

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Hong Lieu: to still be surprised. Like, I say, I watch a lot of anime stuff, and I grew up watching anime stuff to be really shocked and like impressed like thoroughly thoroughly impressed by something. Nowadays it takes a lot. I'm jaded and old, so it takes a lot to not to bowl me over. But that was it was an incredible experience. And and just a great show

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: absolutely. Yeah.

 

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And then

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: another thing that I just want to mention is like losing this into Kendrick Lamar. And then, you know, one of his lines is what the Ethis Council Culture dog, and I

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: resonate with that, because there is so much education and learning that goes into living and for folks that may or may not know, and my my partner works at the Sanborn unified school district. The culture there is. There's a lot of hate incidents and hate crimes against black individuals. And that's just kind of been the culture for decades, apparently. After talking actively to different. You know, folks in the community

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: and people in the community. And what I've learned is that when students are caught for doing a hate incident or hate crime, they get suspended.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: And that's a version of cancel culture to me, because what they do is they just get kind of 2 days off of no education, no love. No, no, not being wrapped in all this language that we have now these days like I remember when I was

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: in high school, my halfway device for my parents went to Bakersfield. I was jump for being black and queer. I remember being afraid to go back to school, because

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: 2 days later. They're gonna be there and happen. And it's a way of not

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: but we didn't have a language back then to to really educate folks, in my opinion. But for me, when we talk about council culture, it kind of, continues the polarization.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: when we should really just bring people in and have these tough conversations. So a goal of mine here at at Sbcc is actually to have these in person conversations working title, unpack and understand where we can talk about tough issues, cause if we can't do it at a college campus, where else can we do it?

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: And so yeah, I was listening to that this morning, and I was like, you know, I need it. I need it. That's on my mind. I need to share that.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: And and it's a good point, because in terms of

 

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Hong Lieu: in terms of the idea of cancelling somebody they're not universally cancelled. What they've done is they've been. Can't you know you get you take, take, get rid of some opportunities. But people that love what they're will love. The cut of their gym are gonna give them more opportunities, and it just like it just changes everything where it's. It's it's something that the we need to have a conversation about. If there's a way, if you actually wanna actually shut somebody out. How do you really do that? Or how do you bring them in? And really kind of show them?

 

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Hong Lieu: The the bigger picture and why they're wrong and and how they're wrong. Because, you know, I've heard I've heard murmurs of of issues with Asian students in the district and in terms of that idea of, there's there just aren't a lot of Asian students. So it's kind of a foreign subject for a lot of people. So the first time you have to deal with it is really in one of those probably situations that's that's really problematic. How do you really get to the heart of the issue and and show someone

 

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Hong Lieu: how wrong and how much it affects people, because everyone's always got the. Oh, it's just this. Oh, it's just that. It's just jokes. It's just that I'm just messing around, or it was a one time thing what happened again. But it's like.

 

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Hong Lieu: No, you you have to understand. I mean, it's hard. And it's hard because you're trying to explain to really, really young people about holistic kind of ideas affecting not just this moment or these people.

 

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Hong Lieu: generations, you know and and

 

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Hong Lieu: and how it affects the people, that the the the victims of these of these you know not crimes. But these, these issues it it. If there's trauma that is going to resonate with people, and you have to, you have to have a long view. How do you teach young kids about the long view? How do you teach grown ass adults about the long view, because a lot of them are very short sighted as well. We talk about these big corporations and stuff just just destroying the environment for short term gain. When the if you take a long term holistic view. They deserve to be completely canceled and just shut down because you're

 

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Hong Lieu: I mean they're just ruining. I mean it did. If if we if more. We could teach more people to take a long view. I think we'd be better off. But how? II guess that question is how and it's it's not just up to the kids, it's up to the parents as well. And how do we get that message across all of them, and to show them that the trauma that you sow now it's like a it's like a seed.

 

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Hong Lieu: the disgusting, wretched seed that grows and just, and you don't have to even water it. It'll just show up at random times. Just get bigger from other from unrelated issues, because of that initial strike. And it's just yeah. You just have to. Yeah, it's tough.

 

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Akil Hill: Well, yeah, I mean, I think listening to that link to a bigger conversation about long term views. I mean, we can get go down that rabbit hold of capitalism. And what does that? So? And how does the impact of that still continues to play out? So yeah, that quote is definitely profound. I'm a product of Santa Barbara, a unified school district, and I can tell you like that. That's a real thing. You know, dealing with

 

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Akil Hill: you know, hate crimes and and and then now it's it's I think it's shifted in a lot of ways. Where before it was really isolated to, you know, like black and white. Now, it's a lot of Latino on black and just really. And and I think this is, you know, the piece of really.

 

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Akil Hill: really be the intentional about hiring people. Right? So I feel that there's a lot of people that are more prone to do that when there's less representation. Right? When you got the the teacher in the classroom that you're you're taking classes with, and you're learning from. And they're guiding you and and mentoring you and coaching you like you're gonna be more self.

 

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Akil Hill: and I, even at a young age, you know, I mean. I remember my eighth grade PE teacher Mister, they call him Sugar Bear. Mr. Right was his name in Santa Barbara, Junior high, and was kinda like the first black teacher that I had and the impacts, and how that impacted me and how it impacted other students of color and how they we saw ourselves. We knew we couldn't mess around and and sugar bears class right? Because he demanded so much more from us.

 

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Akil Hill: And you know and I think that's kinda like the entry W way is like, who are we hiring? Our people that we're hiring are equipped to handle situations because it's not a matter of if it's a matter of when and and how do we address that? And so, you know?

 

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Akil Hill: you know, that's why, in a lot of ways, kinda going back to the show, it's such a honor to have you on this Campus Jordan, because that means a lot and sometimes we don't know the effects of that right. Sometimes it only takes a student understanding seeing you knowing your title, and that's it. They're completely changed.

 

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Akil Hill: So it was all good luck.

 

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Hong Lieu: I'll get off the soapbox and bringing it back. The idea of of the idea of cancel culture is really idea of what is the what is the punishment? What what punishment will actually work? Because we, as we've seen in the past, we've we've gone through a lot of punishments. The punishment cycle and a lot of them have not had that underlying effect

 

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Hong Lieu: of truly influencing cause. You don't want to force. You can't force. The behavioral change. That behavioral change has to come from an awareness that what you're doing is is is profoundly wrong. It's not just wrong. It's wrong in a way that

 

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Hong Lieu: has has leaves a trail. I mean, there's the I mean. I guess everything you do that's wrong leaves a trail. But the trail that that these kinds of things lead. I mean, I've seen it first hand, you know. So it's one of the things where I've seen it with, with friends of mine, and there, and you know they're they're grown and old like me, and they still think about these situations, and I think about situations that I've done as a young as a young kid that I wasn't aware of

 

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Hong Lieu: how deep

 

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Hong Lieu: things cut, cause I was a smart kid had away with words, really knew how to twist something to really get like a what a zinger but that! But now I realize you know those I mean, we're in some ways I would have been better off physically fighting and hurting somebody, because those wounds healed much faster

 

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Hong Lieu: than some of the mental wounds that we inflict on each other. And and so the idea of like

 

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Hong Lieu: even cancel culture is not sufficient, because it's not a true canceling, you know, like and even and even is, is, would it? If it was a true cancelling? Would that be good cause you don't wanna cut someone off from there, you know, like from, you know whatever. But at the same time there has to be some, a punishment that works and that sticks, and that really resonates with somebody that makes them rethink why they did something, and you know the reasons why they're rethinking it, not just because I got caught, and I'm

 

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Hong Lieu: you know, being punished, but that I've I really deeply affected somebody. They wouldn't have gone to somebody. I wasn't told if it wasn't just this really really hurtful thing, and just have finding that commonality understanding why they were. You know

 

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Hong Lieu: why, that is what it is. So

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: I like. I think of

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: a lot of like cause I've been. It makes me self reflect, and I and I always come back to education and like wrapping that person and love just an understanding and just being like, Hey.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: let's let's talk about what just happened. But also let's learn like, are you open and willing to learn

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: and if the person isn't, then that's another conversation. But if the person is, I think it's then like, Okay, let's talk about it. Let's bring people from that community. Let's let's work with you. II think, about like places that I've worked in this town. I remember once

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: one colleague, who I thought was like our friend, was

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: fine talking about me being queer, but then would whisper, Oh, Jordan, you're black, and I'm like, why are you whispering? I am. I'm black like what it was. It was weird. It was like a weird. It made me start thinking about well, that organizational culture, that place wasn't good at the same place. I

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: colleagues sharing a video via Skype of another colleague saying the N. Word, they're drunk off their ass, and they're just saying inward, left and right. And then, when I tried to address it, not in like a Hey, this is wrong, but just, hey! This is probably not appropriate, and this is how this made me feel

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: that the leader at that place just completely just missed me. And so it kind of counsel me in another way, if it's like Well, you're not cool.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: And so it was it really like.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: I think there's just we have to address situations when those happen, and we also need to all come together and learn together. Because just dismissing on either side isn't isn't going to going to solve the problem. It never does cause it would have been solved already. There's been so many incidents. If that was it, if that was resolved, it would have been solved. It would have been all solved already. You know it's just about

 

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Akil Hill: thinking it thinking anew. And you know, yeah. So the optimist to me wants to believe that it's there's no like cause there's a sociopath out there. They'll never learn, do they gonna do? But the optimism wants to believe that percentage is very low.

 

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Hong Lieu: And most people, if you give them a little bit of knowledge and a little bit understanding, you know. Find that common ground that that common empathy they will understand, you know, cause there's everybody's got something they don't want rubbed in their face, you know. Not today. It's not to call skeleton in the clouds, whatever, but we all got little things little like like you talk about sports having scatter reports. If you had a sky report on me, you would know how to really twist it to me. If you have you told talked about XY and Z, you know, and it's different for everybody.

 

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Hong Lieu: So it doesn't have to be. So we've gotta have those conversations about like, Yeah, you, we can have fun. We can, Joe. We can do these things. But if you hit those points and you really like. then you when you hurt someone. Yeah, that sort of trauma.

 

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Hong Lieu: You can't do that. You can't do that. And and the same with same with all the comedians II love. Stand up, comedians, I,

 

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Hong Lieu: you know, going back to early isolation, stand up on Vinyl CD. And and then and then started watching the all the hbo, all the def comedy, dam and stuff. So I I'm with a lot of these comics in terms of like, you know you, you can say what you want. That's your job, whatever whatever. But

 

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Hong Lieu: your job is to entertain people and to make people laugh. And so if if someone comes out of that feeling in certain ways. You didn't do your job for that person.

 

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Hong Lieu: You know you didn't entertain them. You didn't make them laugh. So. I still love your art form. I still love you as a comic, but you can't be saying like, oh, I was. Gonna say what I want, that's what it is no your job to entertain me. People laugh. You failed at your job for this person. You have to respect that, too. So yeah, I yeah,

 

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Hong Lieu: it's it's this is A, is a. This is a conversation. We have our own episode on just this conversation. Just try to figure it out, and we'll never figure it out. But same time it's good to have that conversation. It's good to bring issue to light, because that's a lot of these kids. They're just suffering in the darkness. And we need to. We need to bring these out to light. Let them know that that not only do we understand you, we see you.

 

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Hong Lieu: We wish we could help more than we can, and we wish we could do more. And we're just we're lost, too, you know, like, this is a this issue that plays plays adults as as well. And it's just yeah.

 

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Akil Hill: That's a tough nut to crack for sure.

 

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Akil Hill: Alright, I'm gonna throw real quick, because I really wanna get this this

 

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Akil Hill: plug out, because I think people are gonna really enjoy this. But my my choice and I'll be quick with it. For higher learning is a novel that was rented in 22. So it's relatively new. It's gone out. It's gotten

 

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Akil Hill: a lot of well, actually, it's growing on popularity because they're they created a Ti, a TV series out of it. It's called black cake and it's absolutely amazing. I'm in full. Transparency. Haven't completely finished the novel, but I have started the the show on.

 

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Akil Hill: I think it's Hulu that it's streaming on. But it's an amazing story. The author this is her debut book. So I'm sure she's gonna have that her sophomore blues may sit in, because this book is just got so much notoriety of just being a really good read and basically without giving it completely away. It's this. A ladies. It's about a ladies

 

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Akil Hill: childhood trauma what she had to endure and keeping a family secret. It's centered. And in in in Jamaica and the

 

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Akil Hill: the lead actress is basically multiracial, born to a Chinese father and a black mother in Jamaica. And it's just for me like, I just think it's it's from what I've seen. It's really, really, really, really, really, really good.

 

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Akil Hill: So you guys do yourself a favor over the the winter break check out black cake

 

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Akil Hill: and you won't be disappointed if you see me out here and on campus holler at me and be like yo, I checked out, or the series, or I'm reading a book, and I would love to to talk about it within any of my work colleagues. But black cake. That's my nod. Don't sleep.

 

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Akil Hill: I'll get you some black cake

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: over. The winter break resonates with you, bubbles up. It bubbles up randomly, and it'll come around, and you don't resolve it and deal with it in some way.

 

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Hong Lieu: Yeah, for sure. So

 

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Akil Hill: right on.

 

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Hong Lieu: alright. So I got a couple we. This will pro this episode probably come out in January, so it'll be 2024 already. But being that we are recording still in 2023, I wanted to just shout out a few albums that I loved this year.

 

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Hong Lieu: Because, you know, everyone gets their spotify wrapped around this time, and you can know what you spend the most time listening on. Anyone that put out an album in December feels bad, because there they have no chance of getting on anyone spot if I rap cause that that thing dropped November thirtieth, or whatever. So, me being a Youtube music plebe, I get my Youtube music year in review, which came in December a little late.

 

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Hong Lieu: but I actually had a pretty balanced where I the most I spent on something was 5 h, you know, versus like, not like 10,000 min, or I was kind of thinking I was, I would. But

 

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Hong Lieu: this is a record which came out 2022, which is, it's an honorable mention, because it came out 2022. But that did spend a lot of time lot a lot of spins at 2023. I just love her so much. She just like a really genuine person, just really love seeing about what she's thinking about. And so that album. But that's you know. Everyone's that's already on everyone's best of love. It? Sos came out. End of 2022. Yeah.

 

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Hong Lieu: So. But then 2023 East. 2 more put on album in March of let me get the. I don't remember the name of that, but I'll put in the show notes that album they've just been. Every release they put out has been really eclectic and just blending a million kind of musical styles. I mean, there's like there's a pace to it. That gives it kind of this punk Rock vibe, cause they really they, you know, tour with Mickey Blanco. So they do like electronic music.

 

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Hong Lieu: And it's just really high. Vpm, but there's just a lot because it's so eclectic. It really just makes it feel fresh. And it's just like it just gives me that punk rock vibe like he eaves tomorrow like they they go on tour, sometimes with some, some pretty, some some punk artists, and I just

 

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Hong Lieu: just really great, always, always good music. The new album was called

 

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Hong Lieu: Praise the Lord who choose, but which does not consume or simply hop between worlds, so that that album is definitely checking out. But the entire discography east, too, more just has an amazing salary, very eclectic. If you like. Electronic music in any way, you will love East Timor, but if you like other music as well, you'll find something you will love.

 

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Hong Lieu: Another artist, Arlo Parks, put out on this year, where

 

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Hong Lieu: Arlow Park in 2021 that one like album of the year. So they had a lot of buzz, and this they put out this follow up, which you know didn't get as much buzz. But just it's just one of those things like you talk about Kilo Sophomore slump. Sometimes you. You get everything out in your first.

 

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Hong Lieu: you know, piece of work, book, album, whatever. And if people love it, it's hard, because people want to compare everything to that first piece of work, even though it should stand on its own, I mean collapsed and sunbeams is the the. The first album was unbelievable. It deserved all the awards at one but this new album. My soft machine that came out was really good as well, and a lot of great tracks on it, and

 

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Hong Lieu: you know it might not be as good as class. I think that's up for every person to decide. But I thought it was a great record, and there were just a million great songs on there, and just had a great vibe to it.

 

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Hong Lieu: And then the other record, I wanna shout out is Samiya came out with album called honey at the January this year. So it came out the beginning of the year, and I kinda knew already, like, Oh, man, this might end up being like one of my favorite year, even though it came out January, and it has held up she is the daughter of

 

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Hong Lieu: Kathy Najimi, who was in sister Act, you know, and and focus pocus. Yeah. And and I did not know this. But Kathy Jimmy is married to Dan Finnerty, who was, if you ever watch the movie old school, and there's a part where they do that song, the total eclipse the heart. But he adds, all the F. Bombs in there

 

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Hong Lieu: that guy married Kathy to Jimmy and their daughter Samiya makes music, and Samia really is a great.

 

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Hong Lieu: She's really good, I mean, she's always been really good.

 

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Hong Lieu: But her last 2 records she's really kind of come into her own. And just I mean.

 

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Hong Lieu: yeah. So the album for honey, I forget what. It's calling baby something like that. But

 

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Hong Lieu: that was a great, a good record, and I think honey to me is just a really great record, and it's really like a really honest kind of sensitive record. And I love that kind of music, too. So I'm I'm a punk rock. I'm a punk rock. But I got that email side to me, too. And and it just it does hit those hard strings. So yeah, Samiya, Eastimore, Arlo, Arlo Parks. And then one more shout out for an actual kind of punk record short fictions. They're they're a small little band.

 

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Hong Lieu: They put out an album called Oblivion will own me and Deathel. Oblivion will own me, and death alone will love me.

 

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Hong Lieu: and it's it's a about 30 min long all that all the songs like 2 or 3 min. But it's a it's a nice mix of punkin, hard core, and it's like, yeah, but it's got the emo twist to it, too. But that's probably

 

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Hong Lieu: like the record I spent the most time with. And when I looked at my Youtube music Review. That was the 5 h record is a 30 min record. So that means I listen to probably like 15 times, which is, you know, that's that's that's saying a lot for me, cause I do try to keep up and listen to to to stuff every week. So

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: yeah, I'll put all that in the show notes. And

 

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Hong Lieu: thanks, Jordan, for taking the time to come on the show.

 

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Hong Lieu: You did it. It was an honor to have you before we say goodbye any

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: she's talking about

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: bad, because there are people that identify as witches. And there, there's a whole community around it, and I don't want to make fun of them. And then she went and

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: talk to people in that community and got their approval. And I just thought that was, you know, really kind of empathetic and really kind of amazing, especially in like the nineties eighties to do something like that. So I just like that just pops in my head that I had to share. That's really cool, really cool cause I actually hung out with with people in the nineties that were I mean, their parents were, you know.

 

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Hong Lieu: blue harrier in in Spanish tradition. There were, you know, Santa Deia, you know that that sublime song I knew, you know folks whose parents were were kind of into Santa Deia. So and then, you know, when the craft that movie came out and 97, all the Goths thought they were witches, but there were. There were really folks who were really not not joking, but like sincere, with that kind of mysticism and spirituality. So that's that's really cool that you've you've found. I'm I'll I'll look for that quote and that that clip to put in the show notes, because

 

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Hong Lieu: that is, that is really, that is really insightful at that at that time, to be speaking like that

 

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Hong Lieu: for a small kind of class of people like that, and to really kind of like lobby for them, and and so no need. Only people that kind of were on that path like that, you know, like that. That that's pretty cool.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: but but last night.

 

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Jordan Killebrew | he, him, his: thank you both so much. I see what you do on this campus. I see the relationships that you all have on this campus. And this campus is is amazing because of the work that you to do in addition to our whole community. And so I want to thank you for the opportunity. I love and appreciate you both. And

 

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Hong Lieu: this has been really fun. I feel like we could talk for hours. So II gotta give that shout out to a keel cause like I like, I said, I'm mostly doing sitting on the computer or at home half the time. Akil's the one move like make a moves walking through our canvas. He's the one doing the ground. Everyone's dapping him up. III do what I do? I do I? You know II do. I do my little bit here and there, but

 

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Hong Lieu: I'm I honestly for this show. II ride in the keels. Wake a lot of time. He's he's the booker. He's the power player. Find it to bring on. We're on. So okay, yeah, we could do that. And it's a total team effort, you know. That's that's true. That's that's a good. We'll leave it at that. Yeah.

 

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Hong Lieu: But yes, again, Jordan, thank you so much. Thank you for taking the time, Akil, as always. Pleasure honored.

 

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Hong Lieu: and I've

 

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Hong Lieu: until next time you all this is Vaquero Voices. Take care!